Internet Edge Design Considerations

icecream-guy · July 14, 2017, 10:43:33 AM

Quote from: deanwebb on July 14, 2017, 09:59:48 AM

types that will insist that all business functions are 100% critical, everything is top priority, and that you can buy unicorns in bulk via eBay and Amazon Prime.

Amazon really does have everything

https://www.amazon.com/UNICORN-RUBBER-DUCKIES-DOZEN-BULK/dp/B0076ZWTZ6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1500046904&sr=8-2&keywords=bulk+unicorns

NetworkGroover · July 14, 2017, 01:45:39 PM

You should always go active/active if you can. Treating it as a capacity discussion is the wrong direction imo. In other words, you shouldn't have active/active be a requirement in order for your network to handle the load on it. It's purely an HA discussion.

EDIT - I'm now realizing we're really talking about the edge and it may not be as appropriate here... but I stand by my point that any one link should be able to handle the load. I'm probably being unrealistic.

deanwebb · July 14, 2017, 03:02:46 PM

Quote from: AspiringNetworker on July 14, 2017, 01:45:39 PM
You should always go active/active if you can. Treating it as a capacity discussion is the wrong direction imo. In other words, you shouldn't have active/active be a requirement in order for your network to handle the load on it. It's purely an HA discussion.

EDIT - I'm now realizing we're really talking about the edge and it may not be as appropriate here... but I stand by my point that any one link should be able to handle the load. I'm probably being unrealistic.

True. Any *one* link should handle the load. But when managers get grabby and decide that they can increase the load so that there is no redundancy, then that backup link is now a second primary link.

Quote from: ristau5741 on July 14, 2017, 10:43:33 AM
Quote from: deanwebb on July 14, 2017, 09:59:48 AM

types that will insist that all business functions are 100% critical, everything is top priority, and that you can buy unicorns in bulk via eBay and Amazon Prime.

Amazon really does have everything

https://www.amazon.com/UNICORN-RUBBER-DUCKIES-DOZEN-BULK/dp/B0076ZWTZ6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1500046904&sr=8-2&keywords=bulk+unicorns

Yes, but those are not eligible for Prime shipping, and that's where they get ya!

icecream-guy · July 19, 2017, 08:30:28 AM

Quote from: deanwebb on July 14, 2017, 03:02:46 PM
Quote from: AspiringNetworker on July 14, 2017, 01:45:39 PM
You should always go active/active if you can. Treating it as a capacity discussion is the wrong direction imo. In other words, you shouldn't have active/active be a requirement in order for your network to handle the load on it. It's purely an HA discussion.

EDIT - I'm now realizing we're really talking about the edge and it may not be as appropriate here... but I stand by my point that any one link should be able to handle the load. I'm probably being unrealistic.

True. Any *one* link should handle the load. But when managers get grabby and decide that they can increase the load so that there is no redundancy, then that backup link is now a second primary link.

Quote from: ristau5741 on July 14, 2017, 10:43:33 AM
Quote from: deanwebb on July 14, 2017, 09:59:48 AM

types that will insist that all business functions are 100% critical, everything is top priority, and that you can buy unicorns in bulk via eBay and Amazon Prime.

Amazon really does have everything

https://www.amazon.com/UNICORN-RUBBER-DUCKIES-DOZEN-BULK/dp/B0076ZWTZ6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1500046904&sr=8-2&keywords=bulk+unicorns

Yes, but those are not eligible for Prime shipping, and that's where they get ya!

ever since then, all my amazon internet ads are fulll of unicorns... LoL

dlots · July 19, 2017, 10:25:35 AM

Quote from: ristau5741 on July 19, 2017, 08:30:28 AM

ever since then, all my amazon internet ads are fulll of unicorns... LoL

Should have seen mine after I went in drag one halloween... it was scary :-(

deanwebb · July 19, 2017, 10:26:59 AM

Does that mean you are now a brony?

icecream-guy · July 19, 2017, 11:00:13 AM

Quote from: deanwebb on July 19, 2017, 10:26:59 AM
Does that mean you are now a brony?

no, unicorns, not My Little Pony.

It's probably already bad that I know what you are referring to..

dlots · July 19, 2017, 01:29:08 PM

PINKY PIE IS THE BEST PONY!!

https://youtu.be/W29uMcp5BWU?t=9

deanwebb · July 19, 2017, 01:49:20 PM

So... back to the need to have a proper backup line capacity... and to make sure the ISP doesn't route through your network...

LynK · July 24, 2017, 07:41:52 AM

Man,

So I go on vacation, and I come back to this. This thread took a HUGE DETOUR. The idea/philosophy behind active/active is load sharing, while also using both links for BPA. Many execs do get greedy, and it can become messy very quickly. I understand. But why would you force traffic out only 1 ISP, is the other has a much better path.

There is only so much you can do for inbound, and that would be AS-PATH prepending. I am just surprised that there is nothing out here, that can make an engineers life simple, while giving you granular control on your internet routing.

deanwebb · July 24, 2017, 10:08:28 AM

Sorry about the detour, LynK, but I think we got the cart back on the track...

For inbound traffic, there's currently no way to signal a link-balance situation across multiple ISPs. It would be nice if there could be a designated VIP, but we then get into the question of which vendor hosts the VIP and what happens if that vendor goes down... gets messy there, real quick.

We'd need another protocol for this. Say there are two firms that want to send traffic to each other. Both have a desire to link-balance traffic. Firm A could send a message to firm B's routers with information on which paths to balance on, then firm B can respond likewise to firm A. Both firms update their routing tables to balance across those links. Should one or more links go down, routing tables update to prefer the active link. Balance is restored after a link comes back online and a keepalive message verifies the link is up and active, and then the routing tables go back to balancing the links.

icecream-guy · July 25, 2017, 06:27:49 AM

Quote from: LynK on July 24, 2017, 07:41:52 AM
Man,

So I go on vacation, and I come back to this. This thread took a HUGE DETOUR. The idea/philosophy behind active/active is load sharing, while also using both links for BPA. Many execs do get greedy, and it can become messy very quickly. I understand. But why would you force traffic out only 1 ISP, is the other has a much better path.

There is only so much you can do for inbound, and that would be AS-PATH prepending. I am just surprised that there is nothing out here, that can make an engineers life simple, while giving you granular control on your internet routing.

You shouldn't have gone on vacation, you should have stayed around and kept the thread on track yourself. LOL